Education Reform Policy and Legislation Delivery Board minutes: September 2022

Minutes from the meeting of the group on 1 September 2022.

This document is part of a collection

Attendees and apologies

  • Lisa Bird (LB), Chair
  • Liza McLean (LMc)
  • Chris Graham (CG)
  • Robert Skey (RS)
  • Nico McKenzie-Juetten (NMc)
  • Laura Murdoch (LM)
  • Fiona Robertson (FR)
  • Victoria Bruce (VB)
  • Sean Stronach (SS)
  • Tracy Kirk (TK)
  • Matthew Sweeney (MS)
  • Alison Taylor (AT)


  • Eleanor Passmore
  • Adam Reid
  • Linda Pooley
  • Naomi Standford
  • Neil Cardwell
  • Helen Webster


  • Chris Dunne (CD)
  • Gillian Winters (GW)

Items and actions

Summary of decisions and action points

DB0109 – AP08 : RS to reach out to both TK and AT regarding support offered in terms of facilitating a more inclusive engagement approach.

DB0109 – AP09: All to send feedback on Highlight report, Code of Conduct and thoughts for future agenda items and any wider reflections to GW.

Welcome and introductions

LB welcomed members to the Policy and Legislation Delivery Board, she noted new members and highlighted apologies.

Minutes and action points

GW noted DB01 minutes were issued on the 9 August 2022 and comments requested back by 26 August 2022.

Comments were received on adding the College sector to the scope of the PID. The minutes were updated to reflect changes requested. No further comments were received and minutes will be marked as approved.

She noted there were seven actions raised at DB01. Five marked as cleared. The Risk Workshop has been postponed so that action will be reopened. Two actions remain open/ ongoing.

Comms and engagement approach

RS provided an overview of the Comms and Engagement Approach highlighting key points to draw from the paper. A communications plan for consideration by the September Programme Strategic Board is being prepared and related feedback on progress to date will help shape the proposed approach.

He also noted Annex C was in very early stages especially in terms of external engagement proposals. He added that Cabinet Secretary had offered her commitment to support wider engagement where possible, especially in relation to hearing from learners and parents.

He asked the board for comments around the pace of engagement and if there are areas missing and where the key focus should be.

It was noted that the phrase ‘Lets Talk Education’ was in use by a company based in London, which provides teaching support products.

RS noted he would take this back to the National Discussion team for consideration.

The importance of engaging with a wide range of children throughout this process, ensuring meaningful participation and appreciation for the different voices who should be heard, was noted.TK offered to help facilitate more inclusive engagement with a range of different children and young people across Scotland. It was noted that The Scottish Learning Festival might also provide opportunities for engagement.

The Board noted that we must consider the needs of Children who use BSL, and that the language in the strapline may risk excluding them. It was agreed that this should be looked at further to ensure the approach is inclusive.

AT offered to provide help on ensuring we take an inclusive approach.

In conclusion, the Board welcomed the approach taken in this paper, and noted that key messaging should be shared more widely, ensuring we take every opportunity to broaden our engagement.

Action - RS to reach out to both TK and AT regarding support offered in terms of facilitating a more inclusive engagement approach.

Owner - RS

Deadline -  19 September 2022

Target Operating Model toolkit 

At its last meeting, the Board asked for an overview of the design process being pursued to support the preparation of Target Operating Models (TOMs) for the new bodies. RS provided an overview of the TOM toolkit. He confirmed that the current focus is on the work to define the ‘as is’ components of the existing organisations, looking at the ‘what’ and the ‘why’. The toolkit will be iterative and further advice on the steps needed to get us to the TOM and blueprints by December was being prepared and would be added shortly.

Members queried the sequencing of some of the activities across the strategy and delivery layers. RS noted that this was for practical reasons so that pace was in line with policy development and legislative requirements. 

It was noted that Impact Assessments (such as Children’s rights) would be the ‘thread’ to run through the work of the Delivery Boards. The CR(W)IA process provides a powerful tool/vehicle for considering and working towards rights compliance in a more integrated way. The Board asked to see related development in support of the legislative process.

The Board suggested that the future state needs to be more clearly defined especially around the new Inspection Body. For example, it would be helpful to have clarity on the criteria that will be used as the basis for inspection and who will effectively ‘own’ National Standards.

RS noted that the ‘as is’ process which will complete in September would highlight if there is a gap that needs to be addressed.

RS also noted that related Benefit Strategy and detailed benefits mapping exercise would begin shortly and this would help define and articulate the quantitative and qualitative outcomes we expect to see the future state deliver. Taken together with the strategic TOMs, the more detailed criteria for success will emerge before the end of this calendar year.

He noted that future options would be presented through the seven design elements in the TOM toolkit and aligned against these proposed benefits. The Board would have a chance to shape this thinking as it develops over the coming months.

Any other business and below the line (BTL) papers  

LB Highlighted the BTL papers noting that:

Any comments on the draft Highlight Report and Code of Conduct should be sent to GW.

LB also welcomed any suggested items from Board members to include in the agenda for next month’s meeting, and any broader feedback on the Board and what members would find helpful going forward, to support them in their roles for this programme. She confirmed that the legislative process would be a standing item from next month onward.

Action: All to send feedback on Highlight report, Code of Conduct and thoughts for future agenda items and any wider reflections to GW.

Owner - All / GW

Deadline - 19 September 2022

LM thanked the board members for their contributions and ended the meeting – next meeting will be Tuesday 18 October 2022 

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