Building and fire safety working group minutes: 28 November 2024

Attendees and apologies

• Minister for Housing (Chair)
• Minister for Victims and Community Safety
• Alan Johnston – Cladding Remediation
• Alan Morrison – Health Infrastructure and Sustainability
• Andrew Gunn – Building Standards Division
• Andy Dailly – Schools Infrastructure Unit
• Benny Rooney – Building Standards Division
• Colette Templeton – Building Standards Division
• Frank Doherty – Building Standards Division
• Gavin Hammond – SFRS
• Ken Craig – Building Standards Division
• Kenneth Barbour – SFRS
• Neil Mitchell – Building Standards Division
• Scott Young – Building Standards Division
• Stephen Garvin – Building Standards Division
• Steven Scott – Building Standards Division
• Stuart Morrison – Building Standards Division
• Tom Hardy – Safer Communities
• William Connelly – NHS Assure

Apologies

• Cabinet Secretary for Social Justice

Items and actions

Welcome and action points

The Chair welcomed attendees to the meeting and invited an update on actions from the last meeting in June. The following updates were provided:

Action point 1 - The Ministerial Working Group on Grenfell was established over the summer and is currently meeting monthly. A further update would be provided in the meeting.

Action point 2 - An update on the Scottish Building Standards Hub including on the relationship with the First Minister's narrative on business would be provided later. A paper has also been drafted covering the relationship between the Hub and business.

Grenfell Inquiry

In introducing the paper, some brief background was provided on the Grenfell Ministerial Working Group which had been set up in anticipation of the phase two report (published 4 September 2024). The Grenfell Working Group reports to this (Building and Fire Safety) Working Group. Preparatory work had included two deep dive meetings with Ministers to help provide background and context in response to the phase two evidence.

The Inquiry Chair had made clear that the 72 deaths were avoidable. In addition, there had been significant loss of property with a criminal investigation ongoing - expected to conclude in 2026.

The phase one report was published in October 2019. The Scottish Government response to the phase one report was published in October 2020, with an emphasis on safety, building on the Scottish fire regime and practice.

The second phase of the Inquiry commenced in January 2020. The phase two report contained 58 recommendations including on the approach of government, building and product standards and the tone of government. The need to understand how the recommendations applied to and would operate in Scotland was also noted (given devolved building regulations).

Work is now underway across Ministerial portfolios and with stakeholders, noting a mix of devolved and reserved competence. Responses from both the UK and Scottish Governments were expected in Spring 2025.

Work to date included communication and handling plans and monthly meetings of the Grenfell Working Group (GWG). The phase two report recommendations had been split into eight themes to be considered by officials and stakeholders.

It was expected that the February meeting of the GWG would consider the draft response before finalisation in March. There was likely to be a strong focus on culture and the need for culture change. Officials were engaging with the Scottish Futures Trust to explore joint working.

Scottish Government officials were also liaising with the Ministry of Housing, Communities and Local Government. In addition, arrangements were being made for a presentation to be given by Kate Grange KC from the Grenfell Inquiry to officials. This was likely to be in January 2025.

Action point 1 - consider possibility of Ministers attending the planned presentation

Cladding remediation programme

It was noted that the Cladding Remediation Bill had received Royal Assent. The Act contains powers and duties, including creating a single building assessment.

A technical assessment of standards had been published earlier in the year and would come into effect on 6 January 2025, the same date as the Act. Some further work would be required to define some operational aspects, including around the cladding register and evaluation powers.

From 6 January 2025 it would be possible to declare a single building assessment as competent. To date 13 single building assessments had been commissioned with one received and 12 in progress. Decisions on remediation work would follow but 2025 should prove to be the first year of substantial cladding remediation work in Scotland.

All we are aware that pace was important as we moved into the delivery phase, with the UK Government also looking to accelerate remediation work. A clearer picture was also needed in terms of cladding remediation needs in the social housing environment.

Fire risk assessment/Assessor competence

It was noted that there was no legal requirement for formal fire assessor certification in Scotland when assessing domestic premises. The Grenfell Phase 2 report has recommended the introduction of a mandatory system of accreditation for fire risk assessors.

In England, the responsibility would be placed on duty holders to hire competent fire assessors, this work was ongoing. All four nations agreed that competence should be placed on duty holders. One area of differentiation was noted, the assessment of risk and how this related to the level of competency required for assessment purposes.

Stakeholder engagement would continue with consultation likely in the Summer of 2025, though this was dependent on a number of factors.

Fire safety review/Cameron House Hotel

A brief update was provided on the Fire Safety Review, including the current position of the work towards achieving the public consultation in December 2024. At the last meeting of the Building and Fire Safety Expert Working Group, it was agreed that Officials would draft a consultation to reflect on the outcomes and proposals of the Expert Working Group, which would include:

• Historic Environment Scotland publications in relation to the management of fire safety in traditional buildings, conversions and practitioner guidance
• current Scottish Government guidance including but not limited to: Fire safety in existing premises with sleeping accommodation
• strengthening guidance on low level wayfinding systems
• the application of mandatory Building Standard 2.25 'Automatic fire suppression systems' to extensions and low risk conversions in relation to flats, maisonettes and social housing dwellings
• the use of non-combustible cladding for non-domestic residential buildings including hotels, boarding houses and hostels, clarification around the use of backing boards in external wall cladding systems and consider the list of limited exemptions to the ban of combustible materials
• guidance on Battery Energy Storage Systems - call for evidence
• guidance on Car Parks and Electric Vehicles - call for evidence
• guidance on External Premises Information Plates on high rise domestic buildings

Reinforced Autoclaved Aerated Concrete (RAAC) update

As reflected in the overview report published in September (and sitreps), RAAC had moved from the discovery phase to longer-term RAAC management planning across affected sectors.

RAAC in the housing sector continued to develop as an issue. The most recent data from the Scottish Housing Regulator identified 2,445 homes with RAAC across 16 RSLs. Communications continued to emphasise that RAAC was considered a building maintenance issue with responsibility resting with the building owner. The petition before Parliament calling, among other things, for funding support for RAAC affected communities was noted. The Housing sub-group would meet next week (4 December). An item for discussion would be the development of guidance tailored to RAAC in residential settings.

The recent survey and debrief exercise had reflected generally positive feedback concerning the Scottish Government's administrative and organisation approach in responding to the issue of RAAC. Further work would be done around communication, planning for the future building material related incidents and horizon scanning.

Discussion at last week's (19 November) meeting of the Cross Sector Working Group included focus on the future role of the Group. Views had been invited with the suggestion that the Group extend its remit to include other building material issues with a revised Terms of Reference drafted.

The recommendations contained in the paper were noted.

Action point 2 - submission to Ministers regarding recommendations and survey/debrief report.

Verbal updates

Large Panel Systems (LPS)

Background was provided on the work with the UK Government's Building Safety Regulator (BSR) and a reminder of the main structural concerns with LPS buildings. BSR's approach to collating information from their building safety assessment programme with a focus on occupied pre-1970s LPS buildings and proposals to manage these was highlighted. Confirmation was also given of the ongoing work with the Glasgow/SGN case, and that further update would be made by submission.

Action point 3 - Officials to provide further update by submission

NHS estate

An update was provided on the assessment of RAAC across the health service, highlighting that while NHS Scotland Assure were satisfied RAAC had been identified (as far as aware) almost all required ongoing management and review. The focus was now on developing an accessible programme depending on advice of structural engineers.

An update of fire safety policy for NHS estates was also given.

School estate

39 locations had initially been identified with RAAC (of which two schools are co-located). The current management arrangements by local authorities are as follows:

• seven have now completed works to remove RAAC, with two buildings now completely vacated and scheduled for demolition (note: one was already closed)
• a further school has now been demolished

The remaining 29 operation school buildings have the following arrangements in place, as follows:

• seven are currently on site with works to remove RAAC and/or install additional supports
• eight have temporary mitigations in place and are planning works to fully remove RAAC/replace the building
• 10 have installed additional permanent support structures
• four have assessed their RAAC as being appropriately structurally supported, in good condition and are continuing with a monitoring strategy

Action point 4 - cost data on RAAC related work to be collated for information purposes

Futures Board and Hub

It was noted that work under the Building Standards Futures Board Programme was continuing. The Grenfell Inquiry Phase 2 Report published on 4 September delivered 58 recommendations. For those directed to building standards much of the work has already been started and is being considered under the scope of the Futures Board. These changes are aimed at strengthening the building standards system. With funding through an increase to building warrant fees required to support change and strengthen compliance at a local authority verifier level.

To support a strengthened system a new three-year building warrant fee model was introduced from April 2024. Looking ahead to Year 2 fees, officials have been working with verifiers to introduce resource and investment planning as well as undertaking compliance capacity reviews. The outcome of this work will shortly be presented to the Minister for Housing for a decision on any increase in building warrant fees for Year 2.

Strengthening the building standards system will require an increased level of compliance across the system. Work to deliver strengthened compliance to all building types is being taken forward. The end of the pilot stage for a compliance plan approach for high-risk buildings has confirmed underlying actions are suitable and an Early Adopters Phase is underway allowing real project feedback and analysis. Work is also being taken forward on scaling the approach as appropriate on projects not defined as high-risk to ensure improved compliance across all new and altered building stock.

Any other business

Discussion with the Building Safety Regulator on voluntary occurrence reporting was noted - driven by particular design issues or workmanship error. Currently this was provided through Collaborative Reporting for Safer Structures (CROSS), but going forward would be funded by the Building Safety Regulator, with a supplier sought for voluntary occurrence reporting. A BSR tender was likely to go ahead in the new year. BSR would seek a 'Letter of Consent' to take reports from Scotland. This was expected to be provided. While BSR were content to fund this area of work, they may seek a funding contribution from Scotland (and other Devolved Administrations).

Action point 5 - a submission to be provided on voluntary occurrence reporting to Ministers in January 2025

The next meeting is scheduled to take place in June 2025

Meeting close