National Bairns' Hoose Governance Group minutes: February 2024

Attendees and apologies

Attendees

• Andrew Watson, Director for Children and Families, Scottish Government (Chair)
• Laura Buchan, Crown Office and Procurator Fiscal Service, Crown Office
• John Burns, Chief Operating Officer, NHS Scotland, Scottish Government
• Justine Craig, Chief Midwifery Officer, Directorate for Chief Nursing Officer, Scottish Government (deputising for Alex McMahon)
• Cat Dalrymple, Director of Justice, Scottish Government
• Anna Donald, Deputy Director, Criminal Justice Division, Directorate for Justice, Scottish Government
• Ian Donaldson, Deputy Director of Children's Rights, Protection and Justice, Directorate for Children and Families, Scottish Government
• Sharon Glasgow, Protecting Children Policy and Practice Advisor, Social Work Scotland
• Will Griffiths, Bairns' Hoose Unit, Directorate for Children and Families, Scottish Government (deputising for Lesley Swanson)
• Louise Hill, Head of Policy, Evidence and Impact, Children 1st (deputising for Mary Glasgow)
• Alistair Hogg, Head of Practice and Policy, Scottish Children's Reporter Administration
• Jillian Ingram, Joint Investigative Interviews (JII) National Implementation Coordinator, Convention of Scottish Local Authorities (COSLA) (deputising for Laura Caven)
• Jackie Irvine, Chief Executive, Care Inspectorate
• Chantelle Lalli, Justice Lead, Bairns' Hoose Unit, Directorate for Justice, Scottish Government
• Joanna McDonald, Deputy Chief Social Work Adviser, Office of the Chief Social Work Adviser, Scottish Government (deputising for Iona Colvin)
• Carron McKellar, Detective Chief Superintendent (DCU), Police Scotland (deputising for DCC Connors)
• Alex McMahon, Chief Nursing Officer, Scottish Government
• Mary Mitchell, Senior Lecturer in Social Work, University of Edinburgh
• Tricia Lang, Bairns' Hoose Unit, Directorate for Justice, Scottish Government

Apologies

• Laura Caven, Chief Officer, Children and Young People Team, Convention of Scottish Local Authorities (COSLA)
• Jane Connors, Detective Chief Constable, Police Scotland
• Mary Glasgow, Chief Executive, Children 1st
• Sally Ann Kelly, Chief Executive, Aberlour, CCPS representative
• Lesley Swanson, Head of Bairns' Hoose Unit, Directorate for Children and Families, Scottish Government
• Neil Hunter, Principal Reporter, Scottish Children's Reporter Administration
• Shawna Von Blixen, European Barnahus Network Coordinator

Louise Long, Chief Executive, Inverclyde Council, SOLACE representative has withdrawn from the National Bairns' Hoose Governance Group.

Items and actions

Welcome, introductions and apologies (agenda item 1)

The Chair welcomed attendees to the meeting and apologies were noted. 

Minutes of last meeting, matters arising and action register  (agenda item 2)

The Chair invited any comments on the minutes of the previous meeting held on 14 November 2023 and as no comments forthcoming, the minutes were approved.

Regarding outstanding actions/action register, the Chair reminded the members of the ongoing review of the National Bairns' Hoose Governance Group and explained that all outstanding actions would be looked at and followed up, where necessary, in due course. The legacy actions owned by Children 1st were discussed and it was agreed that these should now be marked as complete.

Actions

• 6.1 Bairns' Hoose Unit (BHU) to close off actions owned by Children 1st when a wider review of outstanding NBHGG actions is undertaken. 

Children and young people engagement (agenda item 3)

Two short videos were shared from the Children 1st Changemakers talking about their experience of the justice system and comments were invited from attendees. All agreed that the words spoken from the children in the video clip were powerful, and that they underlined the importance of the work partners were doing and of the Group’s collective commitments to improving the system. The comments of the Group would be fed back to the Changemakers.

Actions

6.2 Group members to provide comments/feedback on the Changemakers video clips directly to Children 1st (to be fed back to the children and young people).

National Bairns' Hoose Governance Group update  (agenda item 4)

The Chair gave a brief update on the work to outline options to Scottish Ministers with regard to future governance arrangements. Key points were then summarised from the discussion relating to governance at the previous meetings of the Group on 18 December 2023 and 15 January 2024:

• There was a need for clarity on the purpose of the Group going forward, hence the proposal of a strategic or advisory group.
• The Group should be able to test the implementation elements of the programme but with a wider impact.
• The Group should have a closer and clearly understood relationship to the Bairns’ Hoose Pathfinder Programme Board and wider governance in the Children and Families landscape.

The Chair identified a view of some members within the group that an independent Chair would be a valuable asset; however, it was re-iterated that this had yet to be decided and there were also other options for consideration. It was noted that the group remained a valuable forum for input on key programmatic milestones, and that key points of engagement for the forthcoming year had been shared with the group. The Chair invited questions or further discussion offline if members would find that helpful.

Bairns’ Hoose Unit (Scottish Government)  (agenda item 5)

Will Griffiths and Chantelle Lalli (BHU, Scottish Government) provided an update of main points.

Key milestones and events

• Pathfinder Introductory Workshop had taken place in November 2023, an event which brought the Pathfinders together for the first time as one group and offered support and advice around analysis, funding, community of practice and knowledge exchange.  
• More specific funding advice was offered via a number of information sessions run by the Bairns’ Hoose Fund Administrators.
• Drop-in sessions/Q&A around the Standards Self-Assessment and Readiness Tool (StART) which had been developed to gather evidence to help understand the starting position of each Pathfinder and at additional points during the Pathfinder phase. 
• An in-person collaborative learning event was being scheduled for 24 April 2024 with an in-person anniversary event planned in October.

Additional ongoing advice and support is being provided by the Scottish Government Bairns’ Hoose Single Point of Contact (SPOC), a named Improvement Adviser and a Fund Manager Development Officer allocated to each Pathfinder.

A knowledge exchange programme was being developed to share learning and a Community of Practice had been launched with a series of Q&A drop in sessions and themed webinars now up and running. Future events were being planned based on feedback from the Pathfinders on what would be of greatest benefit for them. 

Engagement with Affiliate Partnerships had been less comprehensive than engagement with Pathfinders, but each Bairns’ Hoose SPOC was liaising regularly with their allocated Affiliate. The focus had been on funding applications, with a named Fund Manager Development Officer providing ongoing advice and support. 

BHU was keen to build momentum in other areas and Professional Advisers were leading on engagement with local representatives from areas not applying to be Pathfinders to scope their readiness for Bairns’ Hoose and produce a written report on their findings by summer 2024.

Funding

A funding update was shared and summarised below for 2024 to 2025:

• Pathfinder Fund opens 6 February 2024 to 1 March 2024
• Development Phase 1 (Affiliates) opens 6 February 2024 to 1 March 2024
• Development Phase 2 (areas which did not apply) opens 12 February 2024 to 29 March 2024
• Thematic Fund opens 1 April 2024 to 3 May 2024

Up to £3 million would be available for Pathfinders for 2024 to 2025 and £1.2 million for Affiliates. 

With regard to Development Fund Phase 2, comments and feedback from stakeholders were considered when planning this. It was noted that £1 million was anticipated to be available for the Development Fund. Criteria for the Thematic fund were due to be developed and an initial draft would be shared with the group for input. Up to £800,000 was anticipated to be available for the Thematic fund.

It was confirmed that fund spend in financial year 2023 to 2024, amounted to £2.2 million and it was suggested that this possibly reflected timing issues and other pressures on partnerships.

Main discussion points

A question was raised around the legislative developments being undertaken particularly around victims legislation with a concern that children were not sufficiently included in these legislative proposals. It was suggested that the Group should consider this in terms of the delivery implementation moving forward. In response, it was noted that the Care and Justice Bill was progressing through the parliamentary process, and consideration would be given to considerations around the commencement of the various provisions of the bill with regard to Bairns’ Hoose. Resources and capacity requirements in relation to this would also need to be considered.

Agreement on the United Nations Convention on the Rights of the Child (UNCRC) Act was a positive announcement but work had to start rapidly now to get it delivered. There were provisions which needed to be clarified including support to the various organisations involved. The Victims and Witnesses Justice Reform Bill was still at Stage 1 with aim to complete by end of February 2024 before moving through to next parliamentary stage. Deputy Director, Criminal Justice Division, offered to follow-up with members of the Group for further discussion on any related issues.

There was an agreement that there was a large amount of legislative change ongoing. It was noted that an outline of the various legislation as it related to Bairns’ Hoose would be valuable, and that when there was capacity there would be value in producing such a document. The Chair noted that by the time of the next meeting, an update on legislation might be welcome.

With regard to knowledge exchange, it was noted that the European Barnahus Network had a vast amount of experience and learning which might be useful. It was noted that the Scottish Government was an associate member of this network and that there are plans to take advantage of this knowledge. It was agreed that Shawna Von Blixen, as European Barnahus Network Co-ordinator and a new member of the Group, would be a great asset in this regard. University of Edinburgh also had information to be utilised and intended to carry future information sessions for Pathfinders funded by the North Strathclyde partnership. It was noted that Scottish Government would be happy to communicate details of these events via the Community of Practice portal.

In response to a question raised around knowledge exchange in terms of interaction with children and young people, it was noted that BHU were asking Pathfinders to report/present the progress made with this engagement in local areas, which could then be built on.

Some particular challenges relating to the volume of deadlines and correspondence going to Pathfinders were discussed. Scottish Government officials acknowledged these concerns: they were aware of the number of asks Pathfinders were experiencing, during February in particular. It was noted that Scottish Government would pick this up in discussions with Pathfinders and would continue to aim to be responsive, for example by giving more time for completion of the StART tool.

Crown Office and Procurator Fiscal Service (COPFS) said they were preparing a briefing pack related to courts and Bairns’ Hoose for both internal and external audiences. Once finalised the external pack would be available to share with the Group.

Scoping exercise  (agenda item 6)

It was noted that the scoping exercise was in response to feedback from conversations with Pathfinder and Affiliate partnerships and recognising the challenges in implementing such a large transformative programme within the timescales set out. It was noted that conversations with members of the Group had reflected similar considerations. In light of these concerns, Scottish Ministers had agreed that BHU should carry out a scoping exercise with key stakeholders to explore the feasibility and desirability of extending the Pathfinder phase of the Bairns’ Hoose programme.

An overview of the current timelines was given and as a result of Pathfinder and Affiliate partnerships indicating that these timelines were too challenging a proposed extension to timelines was shared. Members were directed to Paper 3 which set out the proposed extended timelines and options and it was re-iterated that views and advice were welcomed from Group members to shape the programme as it proceeded. A discussion then followed focusing on the questions outlined in Paper 3. 

Discussion points

A number of discussion points were raised, including requests for more detail on the blueprint and questions relating to the relationship between Pathfinders and Affiliates. 

In relation to the blueprint, it was explained that while the Standards were the ‘what’ of Bairns’ Hoose, the blueprint would be the ‘how’. The blueprint was to help inform and supplement the Standards, and would build on the Standards rather than losing the valuable work already undertaken to develop the Standards. In light of this there was a sense from members that on balance it would be worth taking the time needed to get the implementation right, rather than risk progressing too swiftly with the delivery of the programme. It was noted that this should be balanced against the importance of delivering Bairns’ Hoose in a timely manner. 

Queries were also raised relating to whether any funding unspent in the 2023 to 2024 financial year could be transferred to 2025 to 2026 to ensure this resource remained allocated to Bairns’ Hoose. Officials noted that funding could not be carried forward in this way, but that one of the aims of the scoping exercise was to ensure that new money would be committed to Bairns’ Hoose in the 2025 to 2026 financial year. It was noted that as ever this would be dependent on budgetary decisions made annually, and subject to Parliamentary approval. 

In relation to the potential for Affiliates to become Pathfinders, concerns were raised relating to funding available to existing Pathfinders and a risk of spreading the resource too thinly. Provided Pathfinders would not stand to lose funding if Affiliates were to be invited to become Pathfinders, however, and provided learning could be gathered from Affiliates, there was a sense such a move would be welcome. It was also noted that the current two-tiered system risked causing confusion among key programme partners. 

Overall, the Group was of the opinion that it would be better to take the time (via an extension) in order to help partnerships to deliver on their objectives. Group members were thanked for outlining their views, and it was noted that these considerations would be reflected in advice to Scottish Ministers.

Any other business

The Chair offered thanks for the support to the Group provided by the Secretariat who was due to move on to a new post within Scottish Government. As a result there would be no capacity around secretariat functions from BHU for a period of time. The Scottish Government would endeavour to keep stakeholders up to date and engaged on key issues going forward, as part of Bairns’ Hoose project delivery. 

As the Group was still in a transitional phase, the Chair noted that the date of the next meeting was still to be confirmed but was likely to be in May.